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Post by biggkidd on Oct 19, 2017 7:09:35 GMT -6
Anyone built or building one?
My current ride is a 88 F150 4x2 regular cab long bed. I call it a grey man service truck because the truck looks like any other old truck. All the extra features are more or less hidden. It has a few nice features like 120 volt current and air compressor on board. I used a 120 amp hour AGM Deep cycle battery mounted under the bed to power the inverter. Put in a 160 amp battery isolator and a 150 amp powermaster alternator. The factory alternator was about 70 amps. Have 150 amp circuit breakers inline to keep everything safe. Also pulled the factory rear tank and replaced it with a 38 gallon tank with a new pump / sending unit. Have a new 19 gallon tank to replace the worn out factory front tank. Just haven't gotten it done yet. I keep a good selection of tools on board to handle most repairs. Along with a come-a-long straps and chains. I still need to find and mount a larger air tank. The little 3 gallon tank just doesn't quite cut it. I also put coil over load carrying shocks all around and the heaviest load range tires that would fit. Truck runs and drives like a new one. Of course with all the repairs I've done more is new than not!
I recently bought a 90 F250 4x4 extended cab long bed to build into a more capable preppers truck. Now I am having second thoughts. It has a ford reman 5.8L engine with 12,000 miles and a bad E4OD auto trans. After doing more research I see that feeding this beast is going to be costly. Not to mention it more than likely wouldn't run after any kind of EMP.
The downfall of both these trucks is EMP will more than likely take them out. How likely is an EMP though? The 7.3 L non computer controlled diesel with a old school non electric automatic or 5 speed manual would be a better choice. Not only because it would run after EMP but because it would get 1/2 again or better fuel mileage. Problem here is I really dislike the sound and smell of diesels. Another option is to go back to carburetor and old school ignition. I hate the thought of giving up the better mileage and convenience of fuel injection and computers though. I could of course keep all the parts that EMP could fry on hand but that would still leave you stranded until the work was done.
What are y'all doing for PAW or prep vehicles?
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Post by papaof2 on Oct 19, 2017 14:06:01 GMT -6
Considering MY age and miles, I'm not likely to be part of an exodus.
If conditions allow, we could use my small pickup (4x2, 4 cylinder, auto but 8+ inches ground of ground clearance) or my wife's Highlander (front wheel drive, 4 cylinder, 6 speed auto but 8+ inches of ground clearance) for a mostly on-road bugout, but the nearest family that isn't in or near a medium or large city is more than 100 miles away by interstate and somewhat farther by the back roads. Either vehicle would have space for us not to arrive empty-handed.
If we could take both vehicles, we could take a couple months of food for the two of us, an assortment of spices (including salt), limited clothing for several seasons, plus Coleman stove, lantern (with extra mantles) and fuel, plus kerosene heater, lamps, lanterns (including one that you can at least heat food on), wicks, 20 gallons of kerosene plus chain saw, gas, 2 cycle oil, bar/chain oil, saw files, lots of other tools, solar panels, batteries, inverters, ham radio, etc. I should also find space for some of the board games our kids liked as there are elementary age kids there and the adults can play Scrabble, Taboo and Pictionary - and possibly get beat by the kids in Monopoly.
If we still had a popup camper, I could pull that and park it away from the first choice destination house so we'd be a minimum of bother inside the house. Sold the popup to my brother-in-law 20+ years ago and pulled it the 400 miles to deliver it the next time we visited them. They now have a fifth wheel trailer with double slide-outs that's a home on wheels - add solar power for fridge and lights and that's a towable bug-out location. (Sadly, they have the "I'll come to your house" outlook which should be greatly moderated by the distance. Their daughter is a school teacher so she would have a useful skill in a post-SHTF scenario and we'd make a place for her if she came.) I have a four man tent but that's not a place to spend any winter and it's not that great a place for a summer in the south - except for kids who've never slept in a tent ;-)
I saw a 1964 Chevy pickup on Craig's List yesterday for $2000. Good engine, OK transmission (in the bed of the truck), needs a clutch, starter and some rust repair. This should be a post-EMP driver because the only thing electronic is the AM radio (if it has one).
The vehicle you have might be OK if you can acquire *all* the electronic controls and *all* the sensors - a dead oxygen sensor might keep you from going anywhere even if you have a replacement engine control computer. A spare alternator and a spare battery isolator also, as they have electronic parts in them. There's info online about protecting things from EMP but basically the metal "wrapping" needs to be as well sealed as a waterproof covering would be but with conductive materials, as a strong or close EMP can apparently get in via any little opening - words from a former Lockheed aircraft electronics engineer when we were talking about protecting computers from EMP - I could see the wheels turning in his head as he avoided things I didn't have the clearance to know about ;-) Think metal case or fine weave copper mesh/screen wrapping with copper foil tape sealing all the edges.
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 19, 2017 16:35:10 GMT -6
I'm not likely to leave here as a place to stay. But the odds of maybe having to go get family and get them back here are fairly high. Not to mention I can use the abilities of a setup truck in my everyday life. In fact already do 3 or 4 times a week in one form or another. The air compressor and tools are the biggest plus so far..
I was pondering metal wrap and such the other night for EMP protection. That foil tape over rubber tape was the best I could probably afford or maybe some sort of loom and metal conduit. One concern here is heat build up. Electronics usually need to stay relatively cool. I don't know much about this sort of thing. Electronics is another major shortcoming in my learnings.
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Post by papaof2 on Oct 19, 2017 18:13:44 GMT -6
Electronics that are out and in use can't be protected easily or inexpensively - the military pays dearly for EMP-resistant or EMP-proof electronics.
Things that can be put away when not in use can be shielded reasonably well with copper screening and copper foil tape - a wooden box lined with copper screening with an inch of overlap at each seam (and the lid) might be good enough - just remember to run a wire from the screening to a good ground. That generally means you have a radio and a TV out to use and one of each to pull out for use after the EMP. Same for a computer or cell phone or the electronics in your vehicle.
Some of the newer vehicles have an "integrated electronics suite" which means even the heater controls are buried a menu or two deep behind a touch screen. No thanks. I prefer controls I can manage with less than a half second glance away from the road.
Mechanical speedometers are also becoming a thing of the past, as the "analog" speedometer has it's pointer on the shaft of a stepper motor (or a servo) that puts it where the engine computer thinks it should be - and, while the digital speed info is correct, few of the stepper- or servo-driven speedometers are as accurate as the mechanical speedometer was in my wife's '95 Camry (moment of silence - it passed on after 20 years).
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 19, 2017 18:29:13 GMT -6
Yeah that's about what I figured on protection.
Back looking through CL maybe someone will want to trade a gas f250 4x4 for a older 7.3L diesel. I have some options here and I'm not in any hurry. Besides I can always start in on other repairs even if I decide to swap engines and or transmissions. Since I currently have 2 running driving trucks and a project truck. If I'm going to do it may as well do it right. Carb and basic ignition on one of these gas engines is also an option.
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Post by papaof2 on Oct 19, 2017 19:50:44 GMT -6
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 19, 2017 20:30:15 GMT -6
They make HEI for fords now. Module change in about ten minutes and cheap enough to keep 2 complete distributors and 2 extra modules. Holley 650 dual feed double pumper. Best all around carb I ever used. Have to have an intake too.
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 20, 2017 15:36:51 GMT -6
Did some wheeling and dealing today traded a 77 Sears Suburban garden tractor and a few odds and ends for a new set of 285/75-16 Maxxis mud grip tires for one of the F250's. So that's one thing off the need to buy list. Now I need to order lugnuts and center caps. I had bought the wheels used a few weeks ago. That allows me to have a complete set of "spare" tires on wheels.
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 23, 2017 9:01:27 GMT -6
I've got an Email in to Monster Transmissions. Checking to see if we can replace the all electric E4OD with a non electric AOD. Either transmission is going to be twice the price I paid for the truck. lol Considering gathering up the necessary items to convert it to carb and basic ignition. That will depend on a few things like can we go with a non electric trans. More than likely if we are all lucky those parts would sit on a shelf collecting dust forever!
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Post by papaof2 on Oct 23, 2017 15:51:13 GMT -6
If we all felt that lucky, we wouldn't be reading prepper fiction ;-)
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Post by biggkidd on Oct 28, 2017 16:45:47 GMT -6
No word back from Monster transmissions. Did some digging on my own and found there is a lot of physical size difference between the two transmissions. Still trying to find out what years 4x4's might have the AOD since I would need a lot more than just the transmission.
Did some work on the other F250 it got new shocks, used wheels, new mud tires, speed sensor, front driveshaft U-joints and an oil change. Needs several new gaskets on the engine, leaking oil pretty bad. Also picked up a new vacuum valve for its transmission. Checked the brakes and associated hardware that all looks good.
Reason for the shiny used rims is sometimes you have to make one thing appear to be another. The new tires wouldn't fit the factory width rims either. So I got the factory looking aluminum rims from that era.
Keeping my eyes open for a winch and a way to mount it more or less hidden. Only downside to that is I would prefer it mounted on a hitch so I could put it front or back whichever made more sense at the time. Also need another gas tank or two for that truck.
It sure drives and rides better now!
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Post by papaof2 on Oct 28, 2017 17:44:42 GMT -6
Don't know what brand of hitch, but Harbor Freight (and probably others) sell the generic mounts for some of their winches so you can bolt or weld the mount wherever you want it. If your winch has that option then you could weld up your own hitch mount.
The HF 2500lb ATV winch bolts to the mounting plate and I have 3 plates for future plans: 1) hitch mount; 2) in the bed of the truck on a removable A-frame type mount that raises the winch a foot or so above the bed so the cable doesn't cut a groove in the tailgate when using ramps for loading and unloading - I would use the bed bolts to hold the frame in place (I have a battery isolator, battery box and a marine battery to power the winch if I get that far); 3) maybe getting things (5000 watt generator) up the ramp into the equipment shed when I'm no longer able to do that manually. I have the bits for solar lighting out there and the only change would be using a battery with more amp hours as I wouldn't be using the winch daily.
Obviously, I didn't buy this winch with plans to take the truck rock climbing ;-) Getting a non-running riding mower to the truck and into the bed are excellent uses for a relatively small winch (I've done that with a 4 strand block and tackle which is MUCH easier than trying to push that much weight up the ramps). If the hitch mount is the right place for a winch, 2500lbs of pull would also work for assisting the truck out of the mud or a shallow ditch (50 feet of cable reaches a long way). Yes, I remember high school physics and know the weight of the truck and the limits of the winch ;-) Rolling loads are much easier to move than those without wheels.
Anything that involves welding is on hold until I'm through with surgery on both eyes and the surgeon says it's OK to weld.
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Post by willc453 on Jan 2, 2018 19:52:00 GMT -6
Sorry I came to this party a bit late, but I must be really old school. Have a 68 Travelall with a 394, 5 speed stick w/locking hubs. Granny is first gear and The White Elephant as I call her, WILL really climb a hill though I have no interest in attempting rock climbing with it. Next is my 72 Scout w/locking hubs, auto tranny and 304 engine. "Latest" vehicle is my 86 Ramcharger w/4 wheel drive you lock into place inside the vehicle and is also an auto with a 360 engine. ALL run 15" tires. The Ramcharger has electric ignition which can be changed to points, while the other 2 use points. Then there's my 72 Ford Ranger. Three speed, no 4wd, but what makes it a beast is NO power steering. You have to get moving to move the steering wheel and it's ALL old iron, meaning heavier than dodo. Battery died on me while at nephews a few years ago and truck was at slight angle in his driveway. The 2 of us couldn't push it the 15-20' to level ground, it's THAT heavy.
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Post by biggkidd on Feb 3, 2018 18:30:12 GMT -6
Picked up one winch on a jeep bumper. I think it is 9 or 10,000lbs. Now which truck should get it? That's the question of the day. Seriously considering just mounting it on a receiver hitch for now. Found out they are not a real good option while in town the other day. Talked to several people (jeep guys) Who've had to replace the truck side mount system after using it for a winch mount. Just not capable of handling any kind of side loading apparently.
Itching to start work on the Extended cab truck but neither the weather or my current funds agree. LOL Thinking of changing direction a little with that truck. I've been wanting to drive cross country since I was a kid stopping along the way and camping to see the sights. So now I'm considering one of those slide in truck bed campers for it. My youngest will be 18 in 5.5 years and I could finally do it. Providing my health and this world hold together that long.
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Post by forthteller on Feb 5, 2018 11:13:54 GMT -6
Anyone built or building one? My current ride is a 88 F150 4x2 regular cab long bed. I call it a grey man service truck because the truck looks like any other old truck. All the extra features are more or less hidden. It has a few nice features like 120 volt current and air compressor on board. I used a 120 amp hour AGM Deep cycle battery mounted under the bed to power the inverter. Put in a 160 amp battery isolator and a 150 amp powermaster alternator. The factory alternator was about 70 amps. Have 150 amp circuit breakers inline to keep everything safe. Also pulled the factory rear tank and replaced it with a 38 gallon tank with a new pump / sending unit. Have a new 19 gallon tank to replace the worn out factory front tank. Just haven't gotten it done yet. I keep a good selection of tools on board to handle most repairs. Along with a come-a-long straps and chains. I still need to find and mount a larger air tank. The little 3 gallon tank just doesn't quite cut it. I also put coil over load carrying shocks all around and the heaviest load range tires that would fit. Truck runs and drives like a new one. Of course with all the repairs I've done more is new than not! I recently bought a 90 F250 4x4 extended cab long bed to build into a more capable preppers truck. Now I am having second thoughts. It has a ford reman 5.8L engine with 12,000 miles and a bad E4OD auto trans. After doing more research I see that feeding this beast is going to be costly. Not to mention it more than likely wouldn't run after any kind of EMP. The downfall of both these trucks is EMP will more than likely take them out. How likely is an EMP though? The 7.3 L non computer controlled diesel with a old school non electric automatic or 5 speed manual would be a better choice. Not only because it would run after EMP but because it would get 1/2 again or better fuel mileage. Problem here is I really dislike the sound and smell of diesels. Another option is to go back to carburetor and old school ignition. I hate the thought of giving up the better mileage and convenience of fuel injection and computers though. I could of course keep all the parts that EMP could fry on hand but that would still leave you stranded until the work was done. What are y'all doing for PAW or prep vehicles? Hi Biggkidd. Interesting topic. My opinion is a man made EMP is just as likely as a solar flare like the one that knocked out Quebec in 1989. Both events would only knock out a localized power grid and electronics. Possibly a state or even half a continent at most. If it hits somewhere else in the world the big concern is what do the rest of the countries do because of the huge advantage given them. Assume it hits eastern USA. Does Russia take advantage of a weakened US and launch an all out attack? Not likely, because the rest of the world is unaffected. A man made device would likely be the prelude to all out invasion and that would certainly be a mutually assured destruction event. A meteorite or other interstellar object hitting the earth and setting off an extinction like climate change is also a possibility. The 2 most likely Apocalyptic possibilities I can see are the slow, very painful kind. Climate change, pushing the world into a smaller and smaller space with less land to grow food and harsher climates to do it in. Polar ice caps are melting in some areas and freezing in others. It is not inconceivable that a 100,000 year old virus or bacteria could be released into our environment and if it mutates with stuff we have here, . Most of the 1st world countries have been vaccinated for every known disease and condition but not for what we don't know. In addition a majority of us have used so many anti biotics our systems would be so slow to respond that the plague could possibly wipe us out as the less medically immunized groups may have systems that will more effectively adapt to the plague. The second is overpopulation combined with communication technology, western education and equality. 3rd world nations and some developing ones are growing in population at an alarming rate. As these populations get to see the conditions North Americans, Europeans and Australians enjoy they will become more and more dissatisfied with the pittance we give them and will become more intent on getting what we have. The reality is that the earth does not have enough resources for the poorest 7 billion people to have a even a quarter of the luxury we enjoy and when they wake up to this fact and use the technology freely available in the world, expect a rebellion like nothing the world has ever seen. When we have sent enough educated, enlightened and liberated men and women back to their countries we will have started the end. The most unlikely event would be alien attack. It is possible that the Kepler and K2 other ships may inadvertently alert an alien race to our existence, that is if there is developed, intelligent life out there. If they have superior technology it is just as likely they are an imperialistic race and not a benevolent race of morally advanced intelligent beings. In my opinion, this is a very dangerous risk but one I would take nonetheless. As for the vehicle, just a few points. Propane has a shelf life in excess of 5 years, diesel about 1 to 2 years and gasoline less than a year with conditioner. A faraday cage inside the hood of your truck and over the electric fuel pump should work to keep your vehicle functioning in the event of an EMP event. I recently bought a 1977 F250 supercab and I will be converting it to propane, (my green contribution to climate change. wink, wink.) The question is, how do you stop unprepared individuals from taking what you did to prepare? My personal preference is a buried underground bunker with everything you need, ventilated and properly drained. Dig it up every 5 years in private to restock it and only your wife knows approximately where it is. Then again, if we open our bibles and take a look at the book of revelations, but that is for another day! Forthteller
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Post by papaof2 on Feb 5, 2018 19:33:00 GMT -6
Propane probably has a nearly unlimited life with a full tank. Diesel in a sealed container can last a LONG time. Diesel in a 55 gallon barrels was OK 50 years later: www.smokstak.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99056 but remember that it was plain diesel not the ultra low sulfur blend that's most common now. Diesel is probably the least dangerous liquid fuel to store. Remember that propane is a liquid when in the tank - "LP gas" does stand for Liquefied Petroleum gas. I keep 10-15 gallons of treated gasoline primarily for use in lawn equipment and occasionally a generator. The gas is treated the day it's purchased and the containers are sealed. If the weather has been dry and the grass doesn't grow much, I might be using 2 year old gasoline. I should get another 5 gallon can, fill it with treated gas and try it yearly until an engine won't run. Then we'd have one set of empirical evidence on gasoline life ;-)
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Post by forthteller on Feb 6, 2018 15:57:55 GMT -6
Propane probably has a nearly unlimited life with a full tank. Diesel in a sealed container can last a LONG time. Diesel in a 55 gallon barrels was OK 50 years later: www.smokstak.com/forum/showthread.php?t=99056 but remember that it was plain diesel not the ultra low sulfur blend that's most common now. Diesel is probably the least dangerous liquid fuel to store. Remember that propane is a liquid when in the tank - "LP gas" does stand for Liquefied Petroleum gas. I keep 10-15 gallons of treated gasoline primarily for use in lawn equipment and occasionally a generator. The gas is treated the day it's purchased and the containers are sealed. If the weather has been dry and the grass doesn't grow much, I might be using 2 year old gasoline. I should get another 5 gallon can, fill it with treated gas and try it yearly until an engine won't run. Then we'd have one set of empirical evidence on gasoline life ;-) correct on the time for properly stored fuel. I was referring to fuel left in the tank of a stored bugout vehicle. I started my propane cube van 5 years after I put it away and ran it on that 200 gallon tank for a week before refilling. It took me less than 20 minutes to get started. I had to change a few seals in the regulator the following week but otherwise the system never deteriorated. The engine was a 4 bolt 350 so it found its way into my street stock car with only a bottom end job. Well over 250,000 ks on it. My first choice for a PAW vehicle would defiantly be propane on an old style Ford or Chevy motor. I think a 300 six ford would likely be a good trouble free truck motor but I have never seen one on propane.
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Post by papaof2 on Feb 6, 2018 16:41:41 GMT -6
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Post by biggkidd on Feb 6, 2018 18:51:23 GMT -6
Have either of you looked into HHO production? Not to run a vehicle per say but in general. I've built 2 very small units and played around with them on a Honda generator. Next step is a fair sized unit to try and run a 5500 watt generator on without additional fuel. The generator will have to have some modification but since I have three just alike to play with.
I will be trying one on my daily driver when I can afford the electronics. On the highway I average 17-18 mpg if I can move that to 20 I'd consider that a win and to 30 a major victory.
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