Some thoughts I had about writing

[admin]

I wrote the below after finishing my first story writing on another board

I learned a lot of things from writing my first story that I have ever posted on a public board.
I learned that writing is harder, for me at least, than it looks.
I learned that even though I had a good idea and a few chapters ready that a writer (at least this writer) needs to know where his story and characters are going when he starts.
I know that this writer at least, needs to not only have a few beginning chapters ready when he starts, he also needs the last chapter done and have a road map or outline to get there
I also know that I like reading these stories better than writing them - and thanks to all the other authors out there that are so good at it.

Good luck with your stories and if you have any helpful hints for writers please post them.

[patience]

Thanks for creating this forum! I'm here to learn for now, and hope to have a story fit to post one day.

[mnn2300]

Don't know if its the best way, but I make an outline of story chapters so I have a road map and just start writing.

[suvalley]

I find that any outline I have in mind, disappears as the story unfolds....however, the ending goal remains firm.

[Jerry D Young]

According to the research I've done, and the advice of a few professionals, I do it all wrong. So don't take any advice I might give (it wouldn't be much, anyway) with a grain of salt and do additional research.

And a side note. Due to time constraints because of my health, and having been accused of plagerism here while back by another author, I quit reading other PAW fiction. But I certainly will, if asked, because I know I'm missing some good stuff. But that accusation hurt, especially since I hadn't read the guy's story to start with.

[toadsticker]

I have a follow though problem....I have several stories on my laptop started but get bogged down in the details after a couple chapters.
Just seems like I have way too much going through my mind when I write and can't keep it all straight.
Outlines don't help yet.
TS

[admin]

To keep my details straight, I keep a separate document with characters names, occupations, and sometimes a couple sentences or a paragraph about them.

[suvalley]

Now I have another question....how does a person determine where to break for chapters?

Some will come naturally, that's a given. Just looking for some insight.

[admin]

I alway break for chapters when I have a large shift in what is happening. I also have done it by days (in story time)

[libertarian]

There are only so many SHTF ideas to go around. Eventually, every author will duplicate another's efforts. Most of the time IMHO it is inadvertent, as it was with you.

I from my few forays into the world of PAW writing learned that I shouldn't write

[bunyip]

Jul 18, 2011 16:35:53 GMT -6 Jerry D Young said:

According to the research I've done, and the advice of a few professionals, I do it all wrong. So don't take any advice I might give (it wouldn't be much, anyway) with a grain of salt and do additional research.

And a side note. Due to time constraints because of my health, and having been accused of plagerism here while back by another author, I quit reading other PAW fiction. But I certainly will, if asked, because I know I'm missing some good stuff. But that accusation hurt, especially since I hadn't read the guy's story to start with.

Well Jerry,
Please consider reading mine. I'd love to have some of my ideas incorporated into your work - would consider it an honour in fact.

(Truth be, I wrote that in a few hours - so don't expect too much.

I've read that Isaac Asimov (I'm a sci-fi tragic) wrote ~600 books. Usually go-to-whoa in one hit. Worked for him.

I (try) to do screenplays too. Bum glue is a problem for me (ie just keeping at it until it's finished). Most things I do are like that though - need to keep at em until they are just plain done!

[mnn2300]

Right now I have 4 stories I am writing, but 2 of them have been in process for over a year now. One I am posting here already (Power's Out) which is an expanded version of one I originally posted over on Frugals before the owner of that board went off the deep end and closed the fiction section and banned all the people that questioned him or didn't tow his line.

The other (working title = Vanished) is sitting at 130 pages currently (in MS Word) and only about 3 weeks into 'the incident'. I keep running into roadblocks in the story line (this scene doesn't make sense unless I go back and build in a reason and supporting charectors) which means going back to the beginning and making changes - that story is really my passion but the charectors in it keep changing it on me - one guy I originally planned to kill off early in the story apparently had plans of his own and has turned himself into a main charector and leader of a group. Lots of time my charectors seem to write their own stories.
My main problem is finding time: family, work, home, chores all need to be taken care of before I can sit down and write and I am lucky if I get a couple hours a week in.

[rvm45]

Jul 18, 2011 16:35:53 GMT -6 Jerry D Young said:

According to the research I've done, and the advice of a few professionals, I do it all wrong. So don't take any advice I might give (it wouldn't be much, anyway) with a grain of salt and do additional research.

And a side note. Due to time constraints because of my health, and having been accused of plagerism here while back by another author, I quit reading other PAW fiction. But I certainly will, if asked, because I know I'm missing some good stuff. But that accusation hurt, especially since I hadn't read the guy's story to start with.

If you want to refer him to me, I'll be happy to give him the type of Dressing down that he so richly deserves, and you are too tolerant, and too much of a Gentleman to give him yourself.

Richard-Heads!!!

Shoot, there aren't any truly new Ideas anyway--and I'm willing to bet that you could have taken his psyoretic idea, and used it to create something far better than he could have done--only you wouldn't.

Jerry, you've given too much reading pleasure, and been far to kind to too many people, to have some Shabnasticator Rag on you.

.....RVM45

[bunyip]

...there aren't any truly new Ideas anyway....

I'm going to disagree with that assertion.

'The Matrix' for one, 'Inception' perhaps as another example, were quite new ideas.

Bit like the patent office guy who in 1900 said that everything that could be invented, had been.

[rvm45]

Inception covered some relatively new ground--but Carlos Castaneda wrote extensively about invading other folk's dreams--back in the 80s.....

And he claimed to be doing it for real.

Matrix--no, I don't think anyone had ever wrote precisely that story line.

I have, or had, an good fictional book, written at least five years before the Matrix--about a complete Simulated Universe.....

Its very hard to explain briefly, but basically--if you run your simulated world through a few billion clock cycles(which would mean a minute or two), that you could shut the program down, but nonetheless, the program would continue to run forever in a "Virtual" World--not "Computer Virtual", "Meta-Physically Virtual".

Scientists have been yammering that many aspects of reality, seem to mimic computer simulations--and that it is conceivable that our whole Universe is an incredibly detailed Computer Program, running on an abstractly high-powered Computer.

And you know, it wouldn't matter how slowly that Computer ran the "Universe Program"--because absolutely nothing would happen, till the Giant Computer moved ahead one more clock tick into the future.

Put an second between each tick; or put a Billion years between each tick--hey, all we register is movement in terms of other movement. In that context, speed just doesn't matter.

When you tallk about people interacting with people--ain't many themes that weren't explored in the Bible.

A jealous brother kills his sibling--Envy, Murder. Another Brother Rapes his Sister (one of king david's sons.) Incest, Rape. Cain told one of the earliest lies of any consequence.

Sodomy--Why do you think Sodom Was destroyed?Oh and Lot--one more example of Incest. The Flood--Genocide.

An effeminate Mama's boy Parlays his mothers favor, in order to cheat his Much more masculine, and admirable brother of his blessing (Jacob and Esau)

The fellow who had one of the first "Really Big Fish" Stories--Jonah--whether you believe him, or not.

And if the Bible, and Homer, and Vergil didn't think of every last possible basic theme in Human affairs.....

Then Shakespeare and Chaucer and Victor Hugo plugged the gaps.....

and if they left any human drama untried, fifty someodd years of Soap Operas have preempted any claim to be the first.

.....RVM45

[pauldude000]

Aug 26, 2011 9:38:18 GMT -6 mnn2300 said:

Right now I have 4 stories I am writing, but 2 of them have been in process for over a year now. One I am posting here already (Power's Out) which is an expanded version of one I originally posted over on Frugals before the owner of that board went off the deep end and closed the fiction section and banned all the people that questioned him or didn't tow his line.

The other (working title = Vanished) is sitting at 130 pages currently (in MS Word) and only about 3 weeks into 'the incident'. I keep running into roadblocks in the story line (this scene doesn't make sense unless I go back and build in a reason and supporting charectors) which means going back to the beginning and making changes - that story is really my passion but the charectors in it keep changing it on me - one guy I originally planned to kill off early in the story apparently had plans of his own and has turned himself into a main charector and leader of a group. Lots of time my charectors seem to write their own stories.
My main problem is finding time: family, work, home, chores all need to be taken care of before I can sit down and write and I am lucky if I get a couple hours a week in.

Dude.... don't fight the story. You will lose the battle.

Think of it as a long distance run, where you have the end goal in sight and you MUST keep your eyes locked onto the goal, otherwise you stumble and fall. The story ends there with frustration and remorse. If you concentrate on minor plot issues to the point where you lose track of where the story is going, the story will never finish as it will always require revision.

Think of it this way. Writing is quite a bit like long distance running. You start the race full of energy, then you take off from the starting line, pumping out chapter regularly. Side streets mean nothing, they are not part of the race. Another place to go, in a different story line. You start feeling the strain half to three quarters to the finish line, and your focus tries to waver. You start saying to yourself.... ten more steps... just ten more steps, as you keep the end plot firmly planted in your mind.

Your race becomes noticed, and people start to cheer. A few cries of moar, moar. This gives you extra strength and determination, so you pick up your pace a little, though keeping the overall pace under control so that you can finish the race. The crowd gets insistent, desperate cries of moar MOAR MOOOOOAAAARRR ringing in your ears. Don't let the crowd distract you, or you will take a wrong turn.

By now your mental muscles vibrate with exhaustion and adrenaline. You can now see the finish line. Crowds surround you chanting you on, as they do love the race.

"MOOOOOAAAAARRRRR" rings off of buildings and the pavement. Remember that there is no finish line to them, the race is everything, as they love the race itself and do not want you to finish. They want to see you run.... and run.... and run some more.

The race HAS to end, or you will. Keep your eyes on the finish line. All races have a starting line, and a finish line, just as all stories have both beginning and end. If you do not know where to start, or where it shall end, you are just running aimlessly.

Unlike a race, you can go anywhere you like between the two points, so long as you keep your eyes on the finish line. Never go back unless you took a wrong turn to start with. Almost always turning back is a sign that the road you follow is a side street not heading towards the finish line.

Paul Andrulis

[papaof2]

I got started on a short story in another genre because all I saw on the related forums looked like MadLibs (fill in the blanks) stories (I'm sure you've seen fan fiction like that, whether about StarTrek or the Hardy Boys). I ran out of inspiration somewhere after chapter 30 and I've not been able to finish it. Having a specific end in mind when I started would have helped in getting it finished. On the other hand, my original intent was a short story, not a novel. I don't plan to publish this story until I find an appropriate end for it.

One thing I did find helpful in keeping track of characters and their relationships was a family tree, with story-related dates and places for birth, death, and marriage (there were about a dozen primary characters and a lot of peripheral people). With a limited number of families in a small area, there can be a lot of connections over multiple generations.

I had a spreadsheet to keep up with dates: when Joe met Sue, when Sue got pregnant (don't want 7 or 11 month babies unless they're part of the story line), when they moved to a location, purchased a key item, planted a key crop, entered/left military service, etc, as well as any nicknames used.

I frequently used the end of the day or a move to another location as as a chapter ender.

I've have a couple of ideas for vignette-size PAW stories, but nothing complete enough to be on paper or disk yet.

[headlesshorseman]

The big problem i have is killing the damn thing. How do you end a novel when you admire all the men and are in love with all the women?

[freshwaterpearl]

You are either going to be cumulative, or investigative, or comprehensive. You have to use what works for each mode of learning and working.

If you are cumulative, then you need to have all of the facts before making a decision or sorting out a problem. This type of thinker probably would benefit from an outline. You can glean more and more facts and put them into your outline. Now, you know where you are headed.

If you are investigative or comprehensive, you are going to make faster decisions and solve problems faster because you leap over and get to business. You may start with an outline, but don’t stick to it. Or, you just start writing, stop and go, and may create an outline to help you keep track of what you are doing.

This is why one person’s ‘suggestion’ for writing an essay or article or novel is great for you and bad for me. Some writers know everything that will happen before putting pen to paper. Others start with a scene or character or color and go from there, curious as to what will happen next. The scientist, Isaac Asimov was the latter, but I think you find far more successful writers that are the former. No judgement, just saying.

I think a major mistake new writers make is in stopping at the first draft. If you aren’t used to writing, the first draft is just that, a draft. Then you go over it and correct the grammatical errors. You go over it and rewrite sentences to make them more or less descriptive. You remove descriptions that aren’t necessary and you add where you need to. You add dialogue or change dialogue into narrative. It’s not sacred; you can omit or change or add.

[willc453]

Sept 4, 2011 17:09:43 GMT -6 bunyip said:

...there aren't any truly new Ideas anyway....

I'm going to disagree with that assertion.

'The Matrix' for one, 'Inception' perhaps as another example, were quite new ideas.

Bit like the patent office guy who in 1900 said that everything that could be invented, had been.

Add Live. Die. Repeat for another original story AND it being a time traveling story too.